YES!! The Pigs Will Be Indicted!

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Posted by MotherJonses
  5,574 02 May 2015, 8:24 pm

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crimsongulf » 01 May 2015 10:06 am wrote:
Charges ain't convictions. Just throwing thugs a bone. Glad the thug is dead. If they in fact took him out, they did society a favor.


You are calling him a thug? He was accused and arrested for allegedly making eye contact with a police officer and running away - in what world is that a crime? Just what statute did he violate? Are you aware of some criminal history the rest of us are not? Or are you just showing your redneck racist southern roots?
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Posted by MotherJonses
  5,574 02 May 2015, 8:54 pm

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Str8tEdge » 02 May 2015 8:27 pm wrote:
MotherJonses » 02 May 2015 8:24 pm wrote:
crimsongulf » 01 May 2015 10:06 am wrote:
Charges ain't convictions. Just throwing thugs a bone. Glad the thug is dead. If they in fact took him out, they did society a favor.


You are calling him a thug? He was accused and arrested for allegedly making eye contact with a police officer and running away - in what world is that a crime? Just what statute did he violate? Are you aware of some criminal history the rest of us are not? Or are you just showing your redneck racist southern roots?


Freddie Gray Rap Sheet Image
Claim: Freddie Gray, who died from spinal injuries while in Baltimore police custody on 12 April 2015, had a lengthy arrest record.

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TRUE

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Example: [Collected via email, April 2015]

Did Freddie gray really have a rap sheet? This is one being shared on facebook
Origins: On 12 April 2015, a 25-year-old man named Freddie Gray sustained grave injuries (from which he subsequently died) while in police custody in Baltimore. Although details about Gray's arrest, custody, and death are still unclear, some aspects of the case have come to light.

On 27 April 2015, the web site Heavy published an article that included Gray's arrest record, as follows:

March 20, 2015: Possession of a Controlled Dangerous Substance
March 13, 2015: Malicious destruction of property, second-degree assault
January 20, 2015: Fourth-degree burglary, trespassing
January 14, 2015: Possession of a controlled dangerous substance, possession of a controlled dangerous substance with intent to distribute
December 31, 2014: Possession of narcotics with intent to distribute
December 14, 2014: Possession of a controlled dangerous substance
August 31, 2014: Illegal gambling, trespassing
January 25, 2014: Possession of marijuana
September 28, 2013: Distribution of narcotics, unlawful possession of a controlled dangerous substance, second-degree assault, second-degree escape
April 13, 2012: Possession of a controlled dangerous substance with intent to distribute, unlawful possession of a controlled dangerous substance, violation of probation
July 16, 2008: Possession of a controlled dangerous substance, possession with intent to distribute
March 28, 2008: Unlawful possession of a controlled dangerous substance
March 14, 2008: Possession of a controlled dangerous substance with intent to manufacture and distribute
February 11, 2008: Unlawful possession of a controlled dangerous substance, possession of a controlled dangerous substance
August 29, 2007: Possession of a controlled dangerous substance with intent to distribute, violation of probation
August 28, 2007: Possession of marijuana
August 23, 2007: False statement to a peace officer, unlawful possession of a controlled dangerous substance
July 16, 2007: Possession of a controlled dangerous substance with intent to distribute, unlawful possession of a controlled dangerous substance (2 counts)
Although many other publications have presented the above-displayed arrest record as revelatory information, Freddie Gray's rap sheet has in fact been frequently discussed by the mainstream media.

For example, CNN obtained court documents showing more than 20 criminal court cases in Maryland against Gray; the Baltimore Sun combed through Gray's arrest record and determined that most of his arrests were for possession of or intent to sell drugs other than marijuana; and the Associated Press concluded that Gray had been "in and out of prison for several drug convictions in Baltimore" since 2008:

Court records indicate that Gray's arrests were mostly for drug possession/distribution charges and various minor crimes, many of which were not prosecuted. He had several cases scheduled for trial in the coming months. One case, involving charges for second-degree assault and malicious destruction of property, was scheduled for a June trial.

He also faced drug charges that were scheduled for trial in April and May. He has been found guilty of drug charges in the past; his sentences were unclear from court records.
Freddie Gray's rap sheet is also a matter of public record and is available via the Maryland Department of Justice web site.

It should also be noted that the above-displayed list shows Freddie Gray's arrest record and not his conviction record:

The record suggests that, as the years went by, Gray became harder to convict of a drug crime. Police kept arresting him. Prosecutors kept putting him on dockets. But after he was convicted of illegal drug possession when he was 18, Gray mostly avoided jail time.

Court records show not-guilty verdicts, cases dropped, closed or put on the inactive docket. There's one "probation after conviction" for a drug charge last August. Those are pretty typical outcomes for someone police frequently suspect of being a street-level drug dealer.
Freddie Gray's arrest record included charges of second-degree assault, distribution of marijuana, and illegal gambling. While many of the charges levied against Gray have already seen their day in court, the final item on Gray's record, a possession charge from March 2015, was "abated by death."


Thug is probably a fair assessment although he certainly didn't deserve to die, unless he actually caused it himself.


Well, I have to give you that one. He was a criminal, but he did not deserve to die. But how would a man in handcuffs and leg restraints in a small metal box being driven recklessly around be able to injure himself to such a degree?
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Posted by MotherJonses
  5,574 02 May 2015, 9:23 pm

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golfboy » 02 May 2015 8:58 pm wrote:
MotherJonses » 02 May 2015 8:54 pm wrote:
Str8tEdge » 02 May 2015 8:27 pm wrote:

Thug is probably a fair assessment although he certainly didn't deserve to die, unless he actually caused it himself.


Well, I have to give you that one. He was a criminal, but he did not deserve to die. But how would a man in handcuffs and leg restraints in a small metal box being driven recklessly around be able to injure himself to such a degree?
Pretty easy. What happens if you stand in a moving vehicle, and it stops quickly? You don't. And what happenes to you if your hands are cuffed and you can't use them to break your fall?


Two things about that

1. You are assuming that he had enough space to stand - and that in handcuffs and leg restraints was able to.
2. If he was seat belted as he should have been - there is no way he could have done that - still negligent.
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Posted by MotherJonses
  5,574 02 May 2015, 9:30 pm

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Kobia2 » 02 May 2015 9:00 pm wrote:
MotherJonses » 02 May 2015 8:24 pm wrote:
crimsongulf » 01 May 2015 10:06 am wrote:
Charges ain't convictions. Just throwing thugs a bone. Glad the thug is dead. If they in fact took him out, they did society a favor.


You are calling him a thug? He was accused and arrested for allegedly making eye contact with a police officer and running away - in what world is that a crime? Just what statute did he violate? Are you aware of some criminal history the rest of us are not? Or are you just showing your redneck racist southern roots?


Perhaps the term Thug came up because of Gary's 18 prior arrests for drug and street crimes?


I have already conceded that I was ill informed of the criminal record - but nothing there was worthy of death - and on that day his "crime" was allegedly making eye contact with a police officer and running away. The states attorney called the arrest illegal.
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Posted by MotherJonses
  5,574 02 May 2015, 9:43 pm

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Str8tEdge » 02 May 2015 9:28 pm wrote:
MotherJonses » 02 May 2015 8:54 pm wrote:
Str8tEdge » 02 May 2015 8:27 pm wrote:

Thug is probably a fair assessment although he certainly didn't deserve to die, unless he actually caused it himself.


Well, I have to give you that one. He was a criminal, but he did not deserve to die. But how would a man in handcuffs and leg restraints in a small metal box being driven recklessly around be able to injure himself to such a degree?


The evidence leads to he fell and landed on a bolt in the back of the van that fractured his neck. Entirely possible considering he'd be unable to break his fall.


Why wasn't he seat belted?
And why did the ride that should have taken less than minutes take 40 - after he was illegally arrested.?
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Posted by MotherJonses
  5,574 02 May 2015, 9:46 pm

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Kobia2 » 02 May 2015 9:42 pm wrote:
MotherJonses » 02 May 2015 9:30 pm wrote:
Kobia2 » 02 May 2015 9:00 pm wrote:

Perhaps the term Thug came up because of Gary's 18 prior arrests for drug and street crimes?


I have already conceded that I was ill informed of the criminal record - but nothing there was worthy of death - and on that day his "crime" was allegedly making eye contact with a police officer and running away. The states attorney called the arrest illegal.


She's Chief Prosecutor of Baltimore... I'm interested to see what evidence is presented that reflects the Tsu Nami of charges the 6 Cops involved are facing.... Keep in mind, the Officer driving the Van is facing the most serious charges... Is there a video of him going Mad Max on the roadways?

This Link is from front page of the BBC, and details all the charges against each specific Cop..

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-32561056



I have not heard of video. I have read that the ride should have taken less than 5 minutes and took 40.
That he was not belted in.

The charges levied do not include intent - just depraved indifference. He didn't mean to kill him - he just didn't care.
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Posted by MotherJonses
  5,574 02 May 2015, 9:54 pm

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crimsongulf » 02 May 2015 9:33 pm wrote:
MotherJonses » 02 May 2015 8:24 pm wrote:


You are calling him a thug? He was accused and arrested for allegedly making eye contact with a police officer and running away - in what world is that a crime? Just what statute did he violate? Are you aware of some criminal history the rest of us are not? Or are you just showing your redneck racist southern roots?


the thug had 18 priors.

yeah, a frikken welfare rat thug. By him being dead probably 5 other negroes will not be killed by the thug.

As long as the thug has dark skin, y'all dumbasses will defend them, regardless of their crimes.

Glad the thug is dead.


A thug is defined as a "brutal ruffian or assassin" by Miriam Webster.
He is a criminal with over 18 charges - but they are almost all drug possision - there is only one assualt charge. That hardly adds up to brutal.

There is nothign in his history to suggest he would ever take a single life let alone the 5 you suggest.
You are showing that lovely southern heritage again.
Could it just be that defense comes because so many are accused of untrue things because of color that those charges are no longer believed - just doubted?
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Posted by MotherJonses
  5,574 02 May 2015, 9:57 pm

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Kobia2 » 02 May 2015 9:47 pm wrote:
MotherJonses » 02 May 2015 9:23 pm wrote:
golfboy » 02 May 2015 8:58 pm wrote:
Pretty easy. What happens if you stand in a moving vehicle, and it stops quickly? You don't. And what happenes to you if your hands are cuffed and you can't use them to break your fall?


Two things about that

1. You are assuming that he had enough space to stand - and that in handcuffs and leg restraints was able to.
2. If he was seat belted as he should have been - there is no way he could have done that - still negligent.


I'll agree there's an argument that can be made regarding failure to follow procedure by not securing Gray by seatbelt... But that is negligence----not homicide..


I think that when you add the extremely extended length of the ride to the lack of a seatbelt you find the elements that the prosecuters are basing their charge on - and it is negligent homicide he is charged with. They are not claiming intent.

Video may still show up as they trace the route and check the private surveillance systems,
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Posted by MotherJonses
  5,574 02 May 2015, 10:07 pm

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golfboy » 02 May 2015 9:56 pm wrote:
MotherJonses » 02 May 2015 9:43 pm wrote:
Str8tEdge » 02 May 2015 9:28 pm wrote:

The evidence leads to he fell and landed on a bolt in the back of the van that fractured his neck. Entirely possible considering he'd be unable to break his fall.


Why wasn't he seat belted?
And why did the ride that should have taken less than minutes take 40 - after he was illegally arrested.?

Illegally arrested? Didn't the cops say that they observed Gray and another juvenile engaging in what appeared to be a drug deal?
I don't know why Gray wasn't seat belted, probably because the cops were lazy. Was the other guy belted in?
And I hadn't read that this ride took 40 minutes and should have taken 5. Where did you read that, and was it because of the riots?


Was the long ride a result of riots that were a result of the death caused by the riots? How?
The states attorney called the arrest illegal. The actual arrest was for a pocket knife - the cops said it was an illegal length and the states attorney said it was a legal length.
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Posted by MotherJonses
  5,574 02 May 2015, 10:10 pm

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golfboy » 02 May 2015 9:59 pm wrote:
MotherJonses » 02 May 2015 9:23 pm wrote:
golfboy » 02 May 2015 8:58 pm wrote:
Pretty easy. What happens if you stand in a moving vehicle, and it stops quickly? You don't. And what happenes to you if your hands are cuffed and you can't use them to break your fall?


Two things about that

1. You are assuming that he had enough space to stand - and that in handcuffs and leg restraints was able to.
2. If he was seat belted as he should have been - there is no way he could have done that - still negligent.

Negligence isn't murder. They should have charged the cop with involuntary manslaughter, but they charged him with 2nd degree murder.
It was a political charge and they'll never be able to prove it.


Every state in the union has a negligent mansalughter charge - some call it depraved indiffernce or depraved heart - but they all have one. There is a level of negligence that deserves punishment. You are not legally allowed to cause the death of another human being by indiffernce or negligence.
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Posted by MotherJonses
  5,574 02 May 2015, 11:53 pm

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golfboy » 02 May 2015 10:09 pm wrote:
MotherJonses » 02 May 2015 10:07 pm wrote:
golfboy » 02 May 2015 9:56 pm wrote:
Illegally arrested? Didn't the cops say that they observed Gray and another juvenile engaging in what appeared to be a drug deal?
I don't know why Gray wasn't seat belted, probably because the cops were lazy. Was the other guy belted in?
And I hadn't read that this ride took 40 minutes and should have taken 5. Where did you read that, and was it because of the riots?


Was the long ride a result of riots that were a result of the death caused by the riots? How?
The states attorney called the arrest illegal. The actual arrest was for a pocket knife - the cops said it was an illegal length and the states attorney said it was a legal length.

lol... you're right. Sorry, long day.
The State's attorney has said a lot of stupid things.


But this can be quantified and measured. Either that knife is a switchblade or it isn't. Either is it too long or it is not.
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Posted by MotherJonses
  5,574 03 May 2015, 12:30 am

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Kobia2 » 02 May 2015 10:09 pm wrote:
MotherJonses » 02 May 2015 9:57 pm wrote:
Kobia2 » 02 May 2015 9:47 pm wrote:

I'll agree there's an argument that can be made regarding failure to follow procedure by not securing Gray by seatbelt... But that is negligence----not homicide..


I think that when you add the extremely extended length of the ride to the lack of a seatbelt you find the elements that the prosecuters are basing their charge on - and it is negligent homicide he is charged with. They are not claiming intent.

Video may still show up as they trace the route and check the private surveillance systems,


The ride could have taken 2 hours or 2 days.... The Chief Prosecutor believes there's evidence the driver of the Police Van is most culpable in Gray's death.... I'm just interested to hear what evidence could be presented to reflect the charges... Did you read the link I posted regarding the charges the 6 Cops are facing?...... Read all of them, then decide is this a case of knowing all the facts this early in an investigation----or is it a blizzard of shit being slung at the wall--hoping something sticks..


I did read the link - it looks like it breaks down to the officers that are charged with just manslaughter are those that should have followed department protocol and put his seat belt on. The driver was the one who actually caused Gray to be thrown about and was the only "actor" - I looked and second degree murder in Maryland is anything that is not first degree. which seems to me intent - there is no accusation of intent to murder.

I would be more likely to think that it is a matter of making an example of someone and not seeing what will stick. There are cases of "rough rides" having paralysed and injured others in many other cities (Philly, Chicago) and this might be a warning to the Baltimore police about this behavior.

It seems like there are many who have forgotten that our founding fathers beieved that it was better to let 100 guilty men go free than to take the freedom of one innocent man. Also that we are innocent until proven guilty . Our police are punishing without trial and executing without verdict - and this is just not right. If we are a nation of laws and our constitution means anything we must address this.
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Posted by MotherJonses
  5,574 03 May 2015, 11:43 am

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golfboy » 03 May 2015 8:55 am wrote:
MotherJonses » 02 May 2015 11:53 pm wrote:
golfboy » 02 May 2015 10:09 pm wrote:
lol... you're right. Sorry, long day.
The State's attorney has said a lot of stupid things.


But this can be quantified and measured. Either that knife is a switchblade or it isn't. Either is it too long or it is not.

Don't know. I heard a cop interviewed who said they saw Gray in what appeared to be a drug deal. The cops went after them, and the two ran opposite directions. Gray got caught.


The charges they filed were for a knife. If there were drugs he would have been charged with possesion - the police charged him with an illegal switchblade knife - which the staes attorney says he did not have - he had a legal pocket knife.
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Posted by MotherJonses
  5,574 03 May 2015, 11:54 am

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larryc12 » 03 May 2015 9:08 am wrote:
MotherJonses » 02 May 2015 9:57 pm wrote:

I think that when you add the extremely extended length of the ride to the lack of a seatbelt you find the elements that the prosecuters are basing their charge on - and it is negligent homicide he is charged with. They are not claiming intent.


Really? What is 2nd Degree murder if not intent?


In the state of Maryland - first dergree muder is the intentional killing of another human being and second degree is all that is not first degree.
So - as the state of Maryland defines it - there is not intent in second degree murder.
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Posted by MotherJonses
  5,574 03 May 2015, 12:49 pm

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Rebel » 01 May 2015 9:52 am wrote:
Maryland State Attorney General has just announced that Freddie Gray's died as a result of the homicidal actions of the racist white pigs who illegally arrested Mr. Gray and subsequently physically assaulted him with callous disregard for his safety.
May these despicable racist white pigs rot in prison.


Sorry, Rebel. I get your anger - but you have your facts wrong. Several of the police officers arrested are black - so they are not "racist white pigs"
Also - though there are reports of his being assualted with batons - there are no bruises - marks- or other evidence of that - just of the spinal injuries.
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Posted by MotherJonses
  5,574 03 May 2015, 8:17 pm

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golfboy » 03 May 2015 7:59 pm wrote:
MotherJonses » 03 May 2015 11:43 am wrote:
golfboy » 03 May 2015 8:55 am wrote:
Don't know. I heard a cop interviewed who said they saw Gray in what appeared to be a drug deal. The cops went after them, and the two ran opposite directions. Gray got caught.


The charges they filed were for a knife. If there were drugs he would have been charged with possesion - the police charged him with an illegal switchblade knife - which the staes attorney says he did not have - he had a legal pocket knife.
Check the reports of the drugs in his system. They may have been ingested.


What the police charged him with - what they put on the record was the knife. There is no way to prove that the drugs in his system where not ingested earlier (unless they were found in the stomach and not the urine or the bloodstream.)

Our legal systems does not function on assumptions but proof. They can believe they saw a drug deal - but they didn't charge him with it - so they didn't think they could prove it.

Why are you so attached to the drug deal story? With 15 or so drug charges no one is claiming him clean and sober. But for most of us drug use is nothing a person should be killed over.
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Posted by MotherJonses
  5,574 03 May 2015, 9:16 pm

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golfboy » 03 May 2015 8:44 pm wrote:
MotherJonses » 03 May 2015 8:17 pm wrote:
golfboy » 03 May 2015 7:59 pm wrote:
Check the reports of the drugs in his system. They may have been ingested.


What the police charged him with - what they put on the record was the knife. There is no way to prove that the drugs in his system where not ingested earlier (unless they were found in the stomach and not the urine or the bloodstream.)

Our legal systems does not function on assumptions but proof. They can believe they saw a drug deal - but they didn't charge him with it - so they didn't think they could prove it.

Why are you so attached to the drug deal story? With 15 or so drug charges no one is claiming him clean and sober. But for most of us drug use is nothing a person should be killed over.

Because I know cops, and they don't arrest people because they don't like how someone looked at them.


So just where are you getting the drug deal story. I googled and read ABC, NBC, CNN and others and none mentioned a suspected drug deal - they all say he was standing with another male and when the LT made eye contact they both ran and Gray was caught. So what was your source?
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Posted by MotherJonses
  5,574 03 May 2015, 9:25 pm

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Rebel » 03 May 2015 9:05 pm wrote:
MotherJonses » 03 May 2015 12:49 pm wrote:
Rebel » 01 May 2015 9:52 am wrote:
Maryland State Attorney General has just announced that Freddie Gray's died as a result of the homicidal actions of the racist white pigs who illegally arrested Mr. Gray and subsequently physically assaulted him with callous disregard for his safety.
May these despicable racist white pigs rot in prison.


Sorry, Rebel. I get your anger - but you have your facts wrong. Several of the police officers arrested are black - so they are not "racist white pigs"
Also - though there are reports of his being assualted with batons - there are no bruises - marks- or other evidence of that - just of the spinal injuries.


Sorry, MJ, but you fail to understand my point. Freddie Gray was illegally arrested and subjected to homicidal actions of the police because he, a black man, dared to make eye contact with the police. The police had absolutely no due cause to arrest him and subject him to the treatment that resulted in his death other than the fact that he was black. The skin color of the cops isn't relevant.


Was it because he made eye contact or because he ran away ? Cops are like wild dogs you run and they chase.
I I fear by pinning this on just race we will lose the opportunity to address the greater issues of over militarization, training that leaves them jump, and poor background
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Posted by MotherJonses
  5,574 03 May 2015, 10:05 pm

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Rebel » 03 May 2015 9:30 pm wrote:
MotherJonses » 03 May 2015 9:25 pm wrote:
Rebel » 03 May 2015 9:05 pm wrote:

Sorry, MJ, but you fail to understand my point. Freddie Gray was illegally arrested and subjected to homicidal actions of the police because he, a black man, dared to make eye contact with the police. The police had absolutely no due cause to arrest him and subject him to the treatment that resulted in his death other than the fact that he was black. The skin color of the cops isn't relevant.


Was it because he made eye contact or because he ran away ? Cops are like wild dogs you run and they chase.
I I fear by pinning this on just race we will lose the opportunity to address the greater issues of over militarization, training that leaves them jump, and poor background
checks.

I watched some interesting stuff on CNN this morning. It may not just be a racial issue, but one of social status as well. Still, Gray's ethnicity did play a pivotal role in the cops decision to pursue and arrest him illegally and without due cause. And, yes, the arrest was illegal, and the cops' reluctance to call for medical assistance when it was obvious Gray was in extreme physical duress is justification for the indictments. I doubt a white 'suspect' would have received the same brutal treatment.


There are white suspects that get treated that way. You-tube is full of it. There are absolutly issues of class Madoff's kids never got a rough ride. This is what I mean about the greater issues that will not be dealt with if we focus on race.
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Posted by MotherJonses
  5,574 25 Jun 2015, 9:34 pm

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crimsongulf » 23 Jun 2015 8:41 pm wrote:
Kobia2 » 23 Jun 2015 8:21 pm wrote:

Odds aren't looking good for the Race-Bating faithful on this one either... On the Kelley Files tonight it's been leaked there's nothing in the coroner's initial report to substantiate any of the serious charges brought against the Officers----more importantly they were pressured by the Baltimore DA to re-interpret their findings to substantiate the allegations.... The re-wording of their interpretation is apparently every defence attorney's dream... I'd love to see them bring Alan Dershowitz aboard on behalf of the accused Cops..


Autopsy also revealed opiate and weed.

Imagine that.


Wow. I was unaware that drug use would damage your spine like that.
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