Capitalism vs Socialism

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Posted by Brattle Street
  15,017 08 Jan 2014, 12:05 am

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Cedarswamp » 07 Jan 2014 10:43 pm wrote:

I suggest you educate yourself on socialism, because like most conservatives you don't seem to know what the term means.


why would you pass up this opportunity to educate us all? don't you any responsibility to the advancement of society?
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Posted by TotallyRad
  7,037 08 Jan 2014, 12:07 am

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Cedarswamp » 07 Jan 2014 11:04 pm wrote:
TotallyRad » 07 Jan 2014 10:47 pm wrote:

I suggest you educate yourself on socialism instead. It's not whatever you want it to mean. Like it or don't, We have a hybrid economy with both free trade and socialism. Socialism is stigmata to the easily scared. Any economy built entirely on one model will fail.


Remain ignorant, your choice, but the government providing a service does not make that service socialist.


These services are socialist, no matter how much you say otherwise.
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Posted by Cedar
  9,877 08 Jan 2014, 12:19 am

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Brattle Street » 07 Jan 2014 11:05 pm wrote:

why would you pass up this opportunity to educate us all? don't you any responsibility to the advancement of society?


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Posted by Brattle Street
  15,017 08 Jan 2014, 12:23 am

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i get it. you are not up to the task. Save a little face by at least admitting it
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Posted by Cedar
  9,877 08 Jan 2014, 12:30 am

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Brattle Street » 07 Jan 2014 11:23 pm wrote:

i get it. you are not up to the task. Save a little face by at least admitting it
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Posted by TotallyRad
  7,037 08 Jan 2014, 12:31 am

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Cedarswamp » 07 Jan 2014 11:19 pm wrote:
Brattle Street » 07 Jan 2014 11:05 pm wrote:

why would you pass up this opportunity to educate us all? don't you any responsibility to the advancement of society?


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Most eloquent concession I've ever read.
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Posted by Cedar
  9,877 08 Jan 2014, 12:43 am

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TotallyRad » 07 Jan 2014 11:31 pm wrote:

Most eloquent concession I've ever read.


Thank you Sir, but don't misconstrue my indifference toward BS :rofl: as concession.
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Posted by Cannonpointer
  12,847 08 Jan 2014, 12:46 am

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PoliticalPopUp » 07 Jan 2014 8:04 pm wrote:
Who built the trucks they use?


I dunno. They look like Volvos to me.
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Posted by Cannonpointer
  12,847 08 Jan 2014, 12:49 am

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Cedarswamp » 07 Jan 2014 10:32 pm wrote:

Damn you fucking progtards are more confused about socialism than the contards.


Most folks just roll with the contards' own definitions, when it hurts their case.

I call that fair. Petard, meet hoist.
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Posted by Cannonpointer
  12,847 08 Jan 2014, 12:50 am

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neue regel » 07 Jan 2014 10:33 pm wrote:

There would be nothing and no one who would step in to fill the void of snow removal if not for government??


Who knows and who cares? Are you switching to anarchist today?
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Posted by Cannonpointer
  12,847 08 Jan 2014, 12:52 am

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TotallyRad » 07 Jan 2014 10:38 pm wrote:

Sure, go ahead and hire some private contractors to clear your freeway without taxation. I'd be impressed if it worked as effectively as its done now.


Considering how many companies will be competing for his dollars, each paying a separate raft of business expenses and each spending mad marketing money to get his business - then making HIM pay for that marketing, - his dumb ass is gonna be shoveling some snow.

Of course, in his magical world, competition will LOWER prices. Why? Because "they" said so - certainly not for any logical or defensible reason. Contards are economically illiterate.
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Posted by Cannonpointer
  12,847 08 Jan 2014, 12:53 am

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Cedarswamp » 07 Jan 2014 10:43 pm wrote:

I suggest you educate yourself on socialism, because like most conservatives you don't seem to know what the term means.


No, most conservatives are bitter little bitches at having their own facile definitions rubbed in their faces.

Know what I mean, Vern?
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Posted by Cannonpointer
  12,847 08 Jan 2014, 12:55 am

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Cedarswamp » 07 Jan 2014 11:04 pm wrote:

Remain ignorant, your choice, but the government providing a service does not make that service socialist.


Is it capitalist, then? Contards inhabit a binary, off/on yes/no world. We try to accommodate an that makes US the bad guys?
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Posted by PoliticalPopUp
  1,099 08 Jan 2014, 1:24 am

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Yeah yeah....labor unions were a necessary part of the capitalist model, the necessity now antiquated. The point is, capitalism is responsible for all the goods government employs. Look - the point is captaism is more effecient....that's all...
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Posted by Cannonpointer
  12,847 08 Jan 2014, 1:51 am

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You tards aren't very savvy about economics, son.

Let's do a logic problem.

Society A has a private medical model, but single payer health insurance which is funded by a payroll tax. The size of the pool is everybody. Everyone is insured, but there issome waste and fraud. Still, costs are kept barely manageable in spite of the fraud, because of the economy of scale and universal participation.

Society B has universal government medical care, funded by a payroll tax and a VAT. Government focuses on cutting costs by providing care that is merely adequate, and by putting a premium on preventive care rather than letting health issues fester and become critical.

Society C has private insurance and private medicine. The insurance companies are profit driven, so they have attorneys whose only job is to create, massage, or find loopholes to wiggle out of liability precisely when their product is needed. There are multiple companies, each competing for business, and each must meet a separate raft of expenses for marketing and delivering their product. Billions are spent on advertising. Because executives are evaluated and bonused quarterly and are mere cogs in an impersonal wheel, the long term well being of the company is NO ONE's concern. This quarter is the exclusive and universal focus from the sales floor to the CEO's office. Waste and fraud are rampant. Millions are without any care at all, but cannot be turned away at emergency rooms. The cost of their care is, by over-pricing, passed on to the only player at the table with money: the insurance companies.

Those who have insurance foot the bill for all of the redundant marketing and redundant office expenses and redundant dividends. They pay for the fraud an abuse. They pay for the emergency room care of the uninsured. This group - the insured - must see to the profits of investors and the profits of the hospitals and the rightly high salaries of skilled medical professionals, all by themselves.

That is a reasonable description of France, England and America - in that order.

France has the best system, and the cheapest. Everyone participates - no one is without care. England has the shoddiest, but no one is left out. America has the least accessible and most expensive - with quality on a par with that of France.

Math is not political - and neither are economics. Whatever your prescriptions an prejudices and preconceptions, the mathematics of those three systems are immutable. They are what they are, without concern for how you feel about it or wish they were.
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Posted by omh
  2,691 08 Jan 2014, 9:20 am

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Brattle Street » 07 Jan 2014 11:05 pm wrote:
Cedarswamp » 07 Jan 2014 10:43 pm wrote:

I suggest you educate yourself on socialism, because like most conservatives you don't seem to know what the term means.


why would you pass up this opportunity to educate us all? don't you any responsibility to the advancement of society?


Socialism is setting the stage for realityn to rule genetic continuation with hope and faith not every ancestor wants to understand self containment. This process allows the fewest to rule the most by vocabulary methodology within the science of psychiarty, the politics in psychology that character counts as everything one needs to know, and a philosophy accepted that genders are worth less not adopting a standardize method of denying self containment to one's skin and this atmosphere.

Brattle, you are a stooge in love with an idea your performance means more to society than your gender adapting to the moment for the species to remain in the moment always now and forever here.

Reality requires every ancestor sacrifice the instinctive curiousity by obeying academic syllogism to spiritual sophistry making up political semantics to economic hyperbole all around hypothetical what if scenarios about time changing details passing through the moment eternally is done from beyond this instant.

So simple generations being educated the same methods of denial as traditional values most every ancestor in charge of saving humanity will never allow honest answers that do not seek exemption or exception to being self contained like everything else that exists without vocabulary arts staging a reality of societal evolution collapsing again. Life doesn't multiply lifetimes, it adds and subtracks with conception and death being inverse proportions of contracting matter expanding details never duplicated as before.

Functioning the same way all the time with or without homo sapien life being part of organic compounding in this atmosphere. Again, simplicity allows choices to deny self containment and from that denial begins absolute power becoming corrupted absolutely within societal evolution training brains to mind linear equations defining an exponential moment on misguiding paths of existential separation of church and state along with academia and economics. First, second, third, and fourth world orders educating separation of ancestry's ancestors to play character roles in creating societal evolution.

So where is society advancing into other than genetic self destruction. Sounds like orchestrating self fulfilling prophecy for profit by those that loath being self contained to their own sole lifetime. The core of where humanity goes wrong every generation repeating the same mistakes expecting different outcomes.

.
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Posted by PoliticalPopUp
  1,099 08 Jan 2014, 4:44 pm

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omh » 08 Jan 2014 8:20 am wrote:

Socialism is setting the stage for realityn to rule genetic continuation with hope and faith not every ancestor wants to understand self containment. This process allows the fewest to rule the most by vocabulary methodology within the science of psychiarty, the politics in psychology that character counts as everything one needs to know, and a philosophy accepted that genders are worth less not adopting a standardize method of denying self containment to one's skin and this atmosphere.

Brattle, you are a stooge in love with an idea your performance means more to society than your gender adapting to the moment for the species to remain in the moment always now and forever here.

Reality requires every ancestor sacrifice the instinctive curiousity by obeying academic syllogism to spiritual sophistry making up political semantics to economic hyperbole all around hypothetical what if scenarios about time changing details passing through the moment eternally is done from beyond this instant.

So simple generations being educated the same methods of denial as traditional values most every ancestor in charge of saving humanity will never allow honest answers that do not seek exemption or exception to being self contained like everything else that exists without vocabulary arts staging a reality of societal evolution collapsing again. Life doesn't multiply lifetimes, it adds and subtracks with conception and death being inverse proportions of contracting matter expanding details never duplicated as before.

Functioning the same way all the time with or without homo sapien life being part of organic compounding in this atmosphere. Again, simplicity allows choices to deny self containment and from that denial begins absolute power becoming corrupted absolutely within societal evolution training brains to mind linear equations defining an exponential moment on misguiding paths of existential separation of church and state along with academia and economics. First, second, third, and fourth world orders educating separation of ancestry's ancestors to play character roles in creating societal evolution.

So where is society advancing into other than genetic self destruction. Sounds like orchestrating self fulfilling prophecy for profit by those that loath being self contained to their own sole lifetime. The core of where humanity goes wrong every generation repeating the same mistakes expecting different outcomes.

.
Oh good - blather gives me excuse to reply with this: Image
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Posted by deezer shoove
  12,241 08 Jan 2014, 6:27 pm

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Cannonpointer » 08 Jan 2014 12:51 am wrote:
You tards aren't very savvy about economics, son.

Let's do a logic problem.

Society A has a private medical model, but single payer health insurance which is funded by a payroll tax. The size of the pool is everybody. Everyone is insured, but there issome waste and fraud. Still, costs are kept barely manageable in spite of the fraud, because of the economy of scale and universal participation.

Society B has universal government medical care, funded by a payroll tax and a VAT. Government focuses on cutting costs by providing care that is merely adequate, and by putting a premium on preventive care rather than letting health issues fester and become critical.

Society C has private insurance and private medicine. The insurance companies are profit driven, so they have attorneys whose only job is to create, massage, or find loopholes to wiggle out of liability precisely when their product is needed. There are multiple companies, each competing for business, and each must meet a separate raft of expenses for marketing and delivering their product. Billions are spent on advertising. Because executives are evaluated and bonused quarterly and are mere cogs in an impersonal wheel, the long term well being of the company is NO ONE's concern. This quarter is the exclusive and universal focus from the sales floor to the CEO's office. Waste and fraud are rampant. Millions are without any care at all, but cannot be turned away at emergency rooms. The cost of their care is, by over-pricing, passed on to the only player at the table with money: the insurance companies.

Those who have insurance foot the bill for all of the redundant marketing and redundant office expenses and redundant dividends. They pay for the fraud an abuse. They pay for the emergency room care of the uninsured. This group - the insured - must see to the profits of investors and the profits of the hospitals and the rightly high salaries of skilled medical professionals, all by themselves.

That is a reasonable description of France, England and America - in that order.

France has the best system, and the cheapest. Everyone participates - no one is without care. England has the shoddiest, but no one is left out. America has the least accessible and most expensive - with quality on a par with that of France.

Math is not political - and neither are economics. Whatever your prescriptions an prejudices and preconceptions, the mathematics of those three systems are immutable. They are what they are, without concern for how you feel about it or wish they were.
Since you went into greater detail about one over the other two by a ratio of about 4 to 1, that gives away the punchline. If I cared (I don't) I could find a lot of the shoddiest things about France (a wannabe power) to throw in the mix. The constant railing against America always seems to accompany some other "lesser" country that does A thing better (at least in the argument).
Ultimately it is a great credit to America that finding isolated items here and there to find a smidgen better takes a global search. I'd still pick America overall against any other country. These little comparisons meant to denigrate actually have that opposite effect.
There's probably a better mousetrap out there too in Bombay maybe.





Tidbit: Residents of Mumbai (and India at large) still call it Bombay. Mumbai is stupid.
This had to be said. :\
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Posted by danobivins
  15,891 08 Jan 2014, 6:41 pm

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I'll bet the dotheads in Bhopal are big fans of capitalism.
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Posted by bingster
  10,948 08 Jan 2014, 6:42 pm

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Can't you give George W's daughters a break? Geezz!!!
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