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Pengwin

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Huey » 13 Jan 2021, 2:55 pm » wrote: The first thing that pops out is discussing the speech.
Well, it's 1. Topical. 2. Trump wanted them to march on the Capitol that very day, and they did.
 
 
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Huey » 13 Jan 2021, 2:55 pm » wrote: The first thing that pops out is discussing the speech.
Who here takes Maxine seriously? Planet of the Apes? :blink:  why debate this.

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Huey » 13 Jan 2021, 2:57 pm » wrote: But they are not discussing them.

Have you read the article on Impeachment yet?  Maybe you should look at what he is being charged with not what is being said out of anger?
 

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sootedupCyndi » 13 Jan 2021, 2:58 pm » wrote: Who here takes Maxine seriously? Planet of the Apes? Image  why debate this.
It's his version of tit for tat.

But he would say - she should have known better.  Now if we can just get him to admit that about Trump...

 

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Pengwin » 13 Jan 2021, 2:52 pm » wrote: What's say we actually read the Article of Impeachment, eh?

https://cicilline.house.gov/sites/cicil ... 011121.pdf
President Trump addressed a crowd at the Ellipse in 9 Washington, DC. There, he reiterated false claims that 10 ‘‘we won this election, and we won it by a landslide’’. He 11 also willfully made statements that, in context, encour12 aged—and foreseeably resulted in—lawless action at the 13 Capitol, such as: ‘‘if you don’t fight like hell you’re not 14 going to have a country anymore’’. Thus incited by Presi15 dent Trump, members of the crowd he had addressed, in 16 an attempt to, among other objectives, interfere with the 17 Joint Session’s solemn constitutional duty to certify the 18 results of the 2020 Presidential election, unlawfully 19 breached and vandalized the Capitol, injured and killed 20 law enforcement personnel, menaced Members of Con21 gress, the Vice President, and Congressional personnel, 22 and engaged in other violent, deadly, destructive, and sedi23 tious acts. 24 President Trump’s conduct on January 6, 2021, fol25 lowed his prior efforts to subvert and obstruct the certifi


But that is not true according to the NYTs no less.

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Pengwin » 13 Jan 2021, 2:58 pm » wrote: Have you read the article on Impeachment yet?  Maybe you should look at what he is being charged with not what is being said out of anger?

I just posted the first accusation leveled.  

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Pengwin » 13 Jan 2021, 2:57 pm » wrote: Well, it's 1. Topical. 2. Trump wanted them to march on the Capitol that very day, and they did.

But those who attacked the Capital were not at the speech.  

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Pengwin » 13 Jan 2021, 2:59 pm » wrote: It's his version of tit for tat.

But he would say - she should have known better.  Now if we can just get him to admit that about Trump...
Where did she get her money from. Give her a big kiss? Then move on to Whoopie? :rofl:  

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Pengwin » 13 Jan 2021, 2:59 pm » wrote: It's his version of tit for tat.

But he would say - she should have known better.  Now if we can just get him to admit that about Trump...

Nah, it is fun pointing out hypocrisy.

@sooted up Cyndi  

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"In the months preceding the Joint Ses-3sion, President Trump repeatedly issued false statements 4asserting that the Presidential election results were the 5product of widespread fraud and should not be accepted 6by the American people or certified by State or Federal 7officials. Shortly before the Joint Session commenced, 8President Trump addressed a crowd at the Ellipse in 9Washington, DC. There, he reiterated false claims that ‘‘we won this election, and we won it by a landslide’’. He 10also willfully made statements that, in context, encour-11aged—and foreseeably resulted in—lawless action at the 12Capitol, such as: ‘‘if you don’t fight like hell you’re not 13going to have a country anymore’’. Thus incited by Presi-14dent Trump, members of the crowd he had addressed, in 15an attempt to, among other objectives, interfere with the 16Joint Session’s solemn constitutional duty to certify the 17results of the 2020 Presidential election, unlawfully 18breached and vandalized the Capitol, injured and killed 19law enforcement personnel, menaced Members of Con-20gress, the Vice President, and Congressional personnel, 21and engaged in other violent, deadly, destructive, and sedi-22tious acts. 23President Trump’s conduct on January 6, 2021, fol-24lowed his prior efforts to subvert and obstruct the certifi-25VerDate Mar 15 2010 23:08 Jan 10, 2021 Jkt 000000 PO 00000 Frm 00003 Fmt 6652 Sfmt 6201 C:\USERS\MLLEWIS\APPDATA\ROAMING\SOFTQUAD\XMETAL\11.0\GEN\C\ARTICLES.X
4 cation of the results of the 2020 Presidential election. 1Those prior efforts included a phone call on January 2, 22021, during which President Trump urged the secretary 3of state of Georgia, Brad Raffensperger, to ‘‘find’’ enough 4votes to overturn the Georgia Presidential election results 5and threatened Secretary Raffensperger if he failed to do 6so. 7In all this, President Trump gravely endangered the 8security of the United States and its institutions of Gov-9ernment. He threatened the integrity of the democratic 10system, interfered with the peaceful transition of power, 11and imperiled a coequal branch of Government. He there-12by betrayed his trust as President, to the manifest injury 13of the people of the United States. 14Wherefore, Donald John Trump, by such conduct, 15has demonstrated that he will remain a threat to national 16security, democracy, and the Constitution if allowed to re-17main in office, and has acted in a manner grossly incom-18patible with self-governance and the rule of law. Donald 19John Trump thus warrants impeachment and trial, re-20moval from office, and disqualification to hold and enjoy 21any office of honor, trust, or profit under the United 22States. 23VerDate Mar 15 2010 23:08 Jan 10, 2021 Jkt 000000 PO 00000 Frm 00004 Fmt 6652 Sfmt 6201 C:\USERS\MLLEWIS\APPDATA\ROAMING\SOFTQUAD\XMETAL\11.0\GEN\C\ARTICLES.X"

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Huey » 13 Jan 2021, 3:03 pm » wrote: Nah, it is fun pointing out hypocrisy.

@sooted up Cyndi
Well, we have four options here.

1. They both incited violence.
2. Neither incited violence.
3. She incited violence by her words but he didn't.
4. He incited violence by his words but she didn't.

Which is it?
 
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Pengwin » 13 Jan 2021, 3:07 pm » wrote: Well, we have four options here.

1. They both incited violence.
2. Neither incited violence.
3. She incited violence by her words but he didn't.
4. He incited violence by his words but she didn't.

Which is it?

It is not my standards that are up for questioning.  And I have already answered.  

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Pengwin » 13 Jan 2021, 2:58 pm » wrote: Have you read the article on Impeachment yet?  Maybe you should look at what he is being charged with not what is being said out of anger?

Yes.  The only other incident mentioned was his phone call to the Ga SOS.  And briefly at that.  

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Huey » 13 Jan 2021, 3:01 pm » wrote: But those who attacked the Capital were not at the speech.
None of them came in after leaving the speech?

Did the ones who attacked the Capitol hear the speech?

Any maybe the Impeachment shouldn't even mention the speech that day?  That's fine by me but I didn't write the Article of Impeachment so I can't help you on that.
 

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Pengwin » 13 Jan 2021, 3:07 pm » wrote: Well, we have four options here.

1. They both incited violence.
2. Neither incited violence.
3. She incited violence by her words but he didn't.
4. He incited violence by his words but she didn't.

Which is it?
Look.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VeNAG7_-udM

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Huey » 13 Jan 2021, 3:10 pm » wrote: Yes.  The only other incident mentioned was his phone call to the Ga SOS.  And briefly at that.
Nothing about an election, or "fight like hell or you won't have a country", things of that nature?
 

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I could look all day long, but that won't answer the question posed...
 

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Huey » 13 Jan 2021, 3:09 pm » wrote: It is not my standards that are up for questioning.  And I have already answered.
Well, are you sure you are presenting the standards of others correctly?

What if they are all wrong but we are correct?  Maybe neither called, in that particular instance, for violence and Americans are just giant PC pussies these days?

Is that a possibility?
 

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Pengwin » 13 Jan 2021, 3:10 pm » wrote: None of them came in after leaving the speech?

Did the ones who attacked the Capitol hear the speech?

Any maybe the Impeachment shouldn't even mention the speech that day?  That's fine by me but I didn't write the Article of Impeachment so I can't help you on that.

Trump continued to speak for 20 minutes after it started.  It is probably a 20 minute walk to the capital.  The breach was 40 minutes in.  The article of impeachment is all about Jan 6th with a brief mention of the phone call to the GA SOS.  

They are building the case on the actions of Jan 6th.  Additionally, they did go thru the Judiciary Committee.  For the 2nd time.  There are no hearings this time.  It is like going from being charged straight to sentencing.  

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Huey » 13 Jan 2021, 2:22 pm » wrote:
Misty » 13 Jan 2021, 2:18 pm » wrote: Those are his surrogates Huey.
You have cherry picked one sentence out of a long speech.
He also told the crowd to “walk down to the Capitol,” adding, “You will never take back our country with weakness.”

Nevermind all the stuff he said on Twitter before January 6th.
He Tweeted, "Big protest in D.C. on January 6th. Be there, will be wild!"

 
No, I am inserting the one sentence you ignore.  I have posted the link to the transcipt to this thread.  Use it to support your argument.

If Trump did so did the Waters, and the congress women from MA is just posted about.  Become consistent and call for their expulsion.  Calling for unrest in the streets after months of violence in the streets, in your eyes, is not inciting violence?  But calling for a peaceful march is?  That is twisted.
​​​​​Trump has been inciting violence among his fans for years and you want to fixate on one sentence from one speech on one day.

I haven't forgotten how in 2016 he told his fans that if they beat up protesters he would pay their legal fees and how be praised a member of Congress who body slammed a reporter.
He said, "Any guy that can do a body slam — he's my guy."
Thus encouraging his fans to attack members of the press whom he designated as enemies of the American people.
(Members of the press were attacked and beaten on January 6th BTW.)
And those are just two examples off the top of my head.
There are many more.

All through 2020 he told his fans that the only way he could lose the election is if it was stolen from him.
He convinced them that if Biden won, the country would turn into a Socialist hellhole overrun with marauding gangs of brown people destroying their neighborhoods.

Then since election day he told them that the Democrats committed massive voter fraud and stole the election from him.

He's been pouring gasoline for years and on January 6th the match was thrown.

One sentence from one speech on one day cannot negate the years of hateful, divisive and violent rhetoric that he has spewed for years.

 
 

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