MMT advocate OBLITERATES Austrian "Economist"

Started by Dantev2

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Posted by Dantev2
  2,626 07 Dec 2017, 6:08 am

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Posted by Dantev2
  2,626 07 Dec 2017, 6:21 am

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LOL


Shervin D
3 years ago (edited)

2017 edit: This may come as surprise but I no longer see the Austrian school as legitimate or accurate. I realised it's just libertarian ideology masquerading as an economic school of thought. If you are interested in how the economy really works, I strongly suggest following Cullen Roche and pragcap.com It's apolitical in its approach to economics.
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Posted by Termin8tor
  11,561 07 Dec 2017, 7:32 am

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Dantev2 » 07 Dec 2017 5:21 am wrote:
LOL

Shervin D
3 years ago (edited)

2017 edit: This may come as surprise but I no longer see the Austrian school as legitimate or accurate. I realised it's just libertarian ideology masquerading as an economic school of thought. If you are interested in how the economy really works, I strongly suggest following Cullen Roche and pragcap.com It's apolitical in its approach to economics.


In other words, you're an imbecile. Thanks for clearing that up.
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Posted by Dantev2
  2,626 07 Dec 2017, 9:24 pm

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Termin8tor » 07 Dec 2017 6:32 am wrote:

In other words, you're an imbecile. Thanks for clearing that up.


Still waiting for one example of you winning a "debate."

Even neophytes like JunkerGreen, with no formal training in economics, can obliterate your infantile talking points with ease.

The fact is you inhabit the lowest rung of bottom feeders, subhuman vermin.

http://social.bioware.com/uploads_user/ ... 197279.jpg

More proof the right (sorry, I meant "principled center" :rofl: ) is mentally ill.
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Posted by Dantev2
  2,626 07 Dec 2017, 9:39 pm

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There's an interesting conversation starting at 1:13:00 and lasts for a couple minutes.

A Stanford economics graduate in the audience (the old man) asks the Austrian "economist" why he thinks booms and busts are a result of government policy, and juxtaposes the consensus view that CDOs, derivatives, credit default swaps, and other instruments of leverage (btw, does Termin8tor know what any of those aforementioned terms mean?), popularized and employed by Wall Street hedge funds/traders, were responsible for the 2008 crisis.

The Austrian "economist" starts backpedaling, and mutters some nonsense about Greenspan/interest rates, but ultimately CONCEDES that he doesn't think the government "caused" the meltdown, but facilitated it (which is closer to the truth).

This response is odd given that the OVERWHELMING opinion of Austrians is that government was responsible. Goes to show you how little integrity hard-right morons are and that calling out their bullshit forces them to acknowledge reality (i.e. most of them are delusional and lying, but not fools).

Anyway, I suppose there are 2 types of people: those smart enough to know that Bawnie Fwank can't cause a global economic collapse, and those who aren't. Guess which camp the spit wad who responded to my OP falls under...
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Posted by charles.thompson
  2,199 07 Dec 2017, 9:54 pm


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Who the hell cares about economics? Communists don't even protest Mises conferences....they protest anti immigration policies. You need to figure out where the real battle is.
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Posted by Dantev2
  2,626 07 Dec 2017, 10:16 pm

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charles.thompson » 07 Dec 2017 8:54 pm wrote:
Who the hell cares about economics? Communists don't even protest Mises conferences....they protest anti immigration policies. You need to figure out where the real battle is.


Most Marxist and communist groups were infiltrated by the "New Left" and now focus primarily on environmentalism, feminism, critical race theory, etc. despite their calls for class revolution. These pseudo-radicals are unwitting (or possibly installed) diluents whose agenda is to sow confusion among the ranks.

As for "who/why care," it's an interesting theory I read about not too long ago and whose validity am willing to ascertain - thus I decided to share with the forum.
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Posted by Termin8tor
  11,561 07 Dec 2017, 11:10 pm

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Dantev2 » 07 Dec 2017 8:39 pm wrote:
There's an interesting conversation starting at 1:13:00 and lasts for a couple minutes.

A Stanford economics graduate in the audience (the old man) asks the Austrian "economist" why he thinks booms and busts are a result of government policy, and juxtaposes the consensus view that CDOs, derivatives, credit default swaps, and other instruments of leverage (btw, does Termin8tor know what any of those aforementioned terms mean?), popularized and employed by Wall Street hedge funds/traders, were responsible for the 2008 crisis.

The Austrian "economist" starts backpedaling, and mutters some nonsense about Greenspan/interest rates, but ultimately CONCEDES that he doesn't think the government "caused" the meltdown, but facilitated it (which is closer to the truth).

This response is odd given that the OVERWHELMING opinion of Austrians is that government was responsible. Goes to show you how little integrity hard-right morons are and that calling out their bullshit forces them to acknowledge reality (i.e. most of them are delusional and lying, but not fools).


Hey Dim, government was the cause, but it went far beyond just Fed policy.

The primary cause was subprime mortgages that Democrats forced banks to make, causing shoddy credit standards to rise up the chain when people with better credit found out the deals people with rotten credit were getting.

But the mortgages that had little chance of being actually paid were at the bottom. They poisoned that entire sector of the securities market, because no one knew what percentage of bad loans any particular loan package had.

Anyway, I suppose there are 2 types of people: those smart enough to know that Bawnie Fwank can't cause a global economic collapse, and those who aren't. Guess which camp the spit wad who responded to my OP falls under...


The world is divided between people like you who have no fucking clue and the rest of us who do.

I've never seen anyone make any such claim. Franks was certainly a big part of the problem, but his entire corrupt party was to blame as well, and a few Repubs.
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Posted by Termin8tor
  11,561 07 Dec 2017, 11:14 pm

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Dantev2 » 07 Dec 2017 8:24 pm wrote:
Termin8tor » 07 Dec 2017 6:32 am wrote:
In other words, you're an imbecile. Thanks for clearing that up.


Still waiting for one example of you winning a "debate."


You're too fucking stupid to know the time of day, Dim, let alone follow even moderately difficult topics.

Even neophytes like JunkerGreen, with no formal training in economics, can obliterate your infantile talking points with ease.

More proof that you're stupid and ignorant.

The fact is you inhabit the lowest rung of bottom feeders, subhuman vermin.

More proof the right (sorry, I meant "principled center" :rofl: ) is mentally ill.


Blah, blah, blah from one of countless babbling moonbats.


Say, how's Venezuela doing these days, imbecile? Only an absolute wackjob like you would deny that it's Socialist. :rofl: :rofl:
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Posted by Dantev2
  2,626 07 Dec 2017, 11:27 pm

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Termin8tor » 07 Dec 2017 10:10 pm wrote:

Hey Dim, government was the cause, but it went far beyond just Fed policy.

The primary cause was subprime mortgages that Democrats forced banks to make, causing shoddy credit standards to rise up the chain when people with better credit found out the deals people with rotten credit were getting.

But the mortgages that had little chance of being actually paid were at the bottom. They poisoned that entire sector of the securities market, because no one knew what percentage of bad loans any particular loan package had.

The world is divided between people like you who have no fucking clue and the rest of us who do.

I've never seen anyone make any such claim. Franks was certainly a big part of the problem, but his entire corrupt party was to blame as well, and a few Repubs.


You neglected to include the terms "CRA," "Fannie and Freddie," etc. as per your talking points and lies.

https://www.federalreserve.gov/newseven ... 81203a.htm


To learn more about the relative performance of CRA-related lending, we conducted more-detailed analyses to try to focus on performance differences that might truly arise as a consequence of the rule as opposed to other factors. Attempting to adjust for other relevant factors is challenging but worthwhile to try to assess the performance of CRA-related lending. In one such analysis, we compared loan delinquency rates in neighborhoods that are right above and right below the CRA neighborhood income eligibility threshold. In other words, we compared loan performance by borrowers in two groups of neighborhoods that should not be very different except for the fact that the lending in one group received special attention under the CRA.

When we conducted this analysis, we found essentially no difference in the performance of subprime loans in Zip codes that were just below or just above the income threshold for the CRA.9The results of this analysis are not consistent with the contention that the CRA is at the root of the subprime crisis, because delinquency rates for subprime and alt-A loans in neighborhoods just below the CRA-eligibility threshold are very similar to delinquency rates on loans just above the threshold, hence not the subject of CRA lending.


Hope I made it simple enough. :LOL:
Last edited by Dantev2 on 07 Dec 2017, 11:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Posted by Dantev2
  2,626 07 Dec 2017, 11:29 pm

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Termin8tor » 07 Dec 2017 10:14 pm wrote:

You're too fucking stupid to know the time of day, Dim, let alone follow even moderately difficult topics.

More proof that you're stupid and ignorant.


Blah, blah, blah from one of countless babbling moonbats.

Say, how's Venezuela doing these days, imbecile? Only an absolute wackjob like you would deny that it's Socialist. :rofl: :rofl:


70% of GDP comes from the private sector = "socialist."
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Posted by Dantev2
  2,626 07 Dec 2017, 11:32 pm

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1980s S/L crisis: "Democrats are responsible"

1990s currency crisis in Argentina/Southeast Asia/Mexico: "Democr...uh, looks like it happened in emerging markets, guess I can't blame them this time..."

2000s mortgage crisis: "CRA/Fannie&Freddie/Bawnie Fwank/(insert gibberish here)"

2010s student loans/car loans crisis (about to cascade in a year or so): "Democrats are responsible"
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Posted by Termin8tor
  11,561 07 Dec 2017, 11:36 pm

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Dantev2 » 07 Dec 2017 10:27 pm wrote:
You neglected to include the terms "CRA," "Fannie and Freddie," etc. as per your talking points and lies.

True, I did forget that. Banks didn't have to risk much of their own money on bad mortgages,
because they sold most to Fannie Mae, which uncritically bought them up.

Banks NEVER would have been so stupid as to risk large amounts of their own money on such poor investments.
But many made lots of money from mortgage fees.


You have as little comprehension of this as you do any issue.
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Posted by Termin8tor
  11,561 07 Dec 2017, 11:40 pm

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Dantev2 » 07 Dec 2017 10:32 pm wrote:
1980s S/L crisis: "Democrats are responsible"

2000s mortgage crisis: "CRA/Fannie&Freddie/Bawnie Fwank/(insert gibberish here)"

2010s student loans/car loans crisis (about to cascade in a year or so): "Democrats are responsible"


Yes, because Democrats are liberal, they are to blame for most major crises. They grossly interfere in the Free Market, causing huge disasters.

Sorry if actual facts get in your way.

For example, the primary causes of the S&L crisis were 1) the inflation re-ignited under Carter, 2) the rotten Carter economy and 3) the repeal of Regulation Q (which was necessary because of the high inflation) and 4) the clause slipped into a Democrat passed bill that vastly expanded how much the federal government guaranteed in S&L bank accounts.

Ignoramus that you are, you don't have the slightest clue what I'm talking about.
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Posted by Termin8tor
  11,561 07 Dec 2017, 11:43 pm

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Dantev2 » 07 Dec 2017 10:29 pm wrote:
Termin8tor » 07 Dec 2017 10:14 pm wrote:
You're too fucking stupid to know the time of day, Dim, let alone follow even moderately difficult topics.

More proof that you're stupid and ignorant.


Blah, blah, blah from one of countless babbling moonbats.

Say, how's Venezuela doing these days, imbecile? Only an absolute wackjob like you would deny that it's Socialist. :rofl: :rofl:


70% of GDP comes from the private sector = "socialist."


Socialism comes in two flavors, Dim. 1) outright government ownership and/or spending

2) Vast law and regulation that interfere in the Free Market.

By those combined definitions, anyone with eyes can see that Venezuela is Socialist, except babbling imbeciles like you.

Then toss in Cuba-influenced intimidation and police state tactics.
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Posted by Termin8tor
  11,561 07 Dec 2017, 11:49 pm

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Dantev2 » 07 Dec 2017 10:27 pm wrote:
You neglected to include the terms "CRA," "Fannie and Freddie," etc. as per your talking points and lies.

https://www.federalreserve.gov/newseven ... 81203a.htm


Hope I made it simple enough. :LOL:


What, you expect the Fed to give an honest appraisal of the cause?

You're dumber than dirt. :rofl: :rofl:

My sister was in the real estate business at the time. I asked her why she wasn't making lots of money selling those troubled properties.


She said that to get decent listings, you had to accept the dogs; unsalable properties in the worst areas of the city. She said that people on welfare had been buying homes and condos.

Illegal immigrants were buying homes with "no-ask" unverified income mortgages.

That bid up the price of housing in highly questionable areas to silly values.

So of course the whole house of cards collapsed when irresponsible people with poor personal behavior were unable to make payments. Illegal immigrants had little stake in their credit ratings, so they often just walked away from their homes that had negative equity.
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Posted by roadkill
  10,093 08 Dec 2017, 8:39 am

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Termin8tor » 07 Dec 2017 10:36 pm wrote:
True, I did forget that. Banks didn't have to risk much of their own money on bad mortgages,
because they sold most to Fannie Mae, which uncritically bought them up.

Banks NEVER would have been so stupid as to risk large amounts of their own money on such poor investments.
But many made lots of money from mortgage fees.

You have as little comprehension of this as you do any issue.


Banks had a sweetheart deal...the loans were guaranteed by the tax payers.

Barney Frank assured us everything was OK.
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Posted by Ricky Tavy
  5,122 08 Dec 2017, 10:55 am

Termin8tor » 07 Dec 2017 6:32 am wrote:
Dantev2 » 07 Dec 2017 5:21 am wrote:
LOL

Shervin D
3 years ago (edited)

2017 edit: This may come as surprise but I no longer see the Austrian school as legitimate or accurate. I realised it's just libertarian ideology masquerading as an economic school of thought. If you are interested in how the economy really works, I strongly suggest following Cullen Roche and pragcap.com It's apolitical in its approach to economics.


In other words, you're an imbecile. Thanks for clearing that up.


You keep forgetting your whimper about "Alinsky ad hominems" and a lack of substance in other peoples' posts.
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Posted by Ricky Tavy
  5,122 08 Dec 2017, 11:01 am


This thread is a classic. Dantev relied on facts and credible sources. After parroting useful idiot memes that Dantev then took apart, Spermineater resorted to hissing-and-spitting and sourcing his "sister in real estate." Can it be possible that "forty years of reading books" and "attending college" left the Spermineater a bit deficient in his education?
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Posted by Cedar
  9,017 08 Dec 2017, 11:07 am

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Ricky Tavy » 08 Dec 2017 10:01 am wrote:
This thread is a classic. Dantev relied on facts and credible sources. After parroting useful idiot memes that Dantev then took apart, Spermineater resorted to hissing-and-spitting and sourcing his "sister in real estate." Can it be possible that "forty years of reading books" and "attending college" left the Spermineater a bit deficient in his education?


Did you get permission before tossing Dantev's salad.....can't be too careful these days.
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